The stuff about "ooh, this wonderful law will also be used against Antifa!" is not only cope but missing the point. If their support for the law rests on its being used to support a friend-enemy distinction then why are none of the people propogating it talking about Antifa? Read any article or listen to any soundbite on this - it's *all* targeted against racist and/or anti-Semitic leaflets or projections. Here's Mike Caruso, Republican:
Yeah, the anti-Semitic leaflets are goofy and I don't support them, but this is a classic case of giving an inch before a mile is taken. This entire bill is targeted at the far Right, and what the Left will do - which is strategically the correct thing for them to do - is simply expand the definition of far Right until it criminalizes normal political speech.
It's insane that people who think DeSantis is the king of "state power" can't grasp these basic points. You either work friend-enemy distinction into your laws or your enemy will do it for you.
Many provisions of bill would seem to run afoul of 1A as interpreted by court in RAV v. St Paul. That case—which seems pretty squarely on point—dealt with a local law providing that:
“Whoever places on public or private property, a symbol, object, appellation, characterization or graffiti, including, but not limited to, a burning cross or Nazi swastika, which one knows or has reasonable grounds to know arouses anger, alarm or resentment in others on the basis of race, color, creed, religion or gender commits disorderly conduct and shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.”
Even though threatening speech and speaking on another’s property without permission are both otherwise unprotected forms of speech, the court held that because the law was content based (it singled out intimidation based on race, creed etc) it had to be subjected to strict scrutiny (a constitutional test unfavorable to the government).
This seems of apiece with desantis passing other bills—like the social media common carrier legislation and the ban on anti-white workplace DIE sessions—that are good policy but shoddily drafted and vulnerable to 1A challenges. Except in this case the law is not good policy
I agree, terrific summarization of HB 269 and its impact on free speech in America and why DeSantis ushered in a defining moment for his political prospects with many conservatives.
My guess is that meatball Ron realised how poorly he's doing with the base and donors and is trying to out-institution Trump and thinks that he can get the zionist neocon wing on side by catering to their hypersensitive obsession with anti-semitism laws. Same thing with the heartbeat bill, he's falling out with donors and congressional endorsements so he's going for institutions like the foreign policy blob and con inc media to try and get the 2024 nomination
Jewish legislator Randy Fine sponsored and helped author this speech killing bill. Jewish elites have been the tip of the spear when it comes to attacking the 1st amendment and arguing for so called hate speech laws, Big Tech censorship, digital book burnings at Amazon and so many other things. The ADL is no friend of a robust 1st amendment.
I haven't heard of any pending legal challenges from civil liberties groups if any still exist. This will be a real test for the SCOTUS if it ever gets to them.
Unless Trump speaks out against this bill I don't see how he's any better than DeSantis.
The stuff about "ooh, this wonderful law will also be used against Antifa!" is not only cope but missing the point. If their support for the law rests on its being used to support a friend-enemy distinction then why are none of the people propogating it talking about Antifa? Read any article or listen to any soundbite on this - it's *all* targeted against racist and/or anti-Semitic leaflets or projections. Here's Mike Caruso, Republican:
https://floridapolitics.com/archives/584052-enough-is-enough-mike-caruso-files-bill-making-hate-acts-antisemitic-messages-a-felony/
Yeah, the anti-Semitic leaflets are goofy and I don't support them, but this is a classic case of giving an inch before a mile is taken. This entire bill is targeted at the far Right, and what the Left will do - which is strategically the correct thing for them to do - is simply expand the definition of far Right until it criminalizes normal political speech.
It's insane that people who think DeSantis is the king of "state power" can't grasp these basic points. You either work friend-enemy distinction into your laws or your enemy will do it for you.
Pretty disappointing.
I used to think American conservatives are 19th century Indians, but I’ve come to appreciate that are much worse and much lower than that.
They should vote for Vivek. He can understand the law (unlike them) and is probably more difficult to bribe and less misaligned culturally.
Unbelievable the low character of non liberal Americans.
Edit: not to overreact, but this is the #2 guy on the right! Supposedly. It’s not some random guy dropping the ball.
Many provisions of bill would seem to run afoul of 1A as interpreted by court in RAV v. St Paul. That case—which seems pretty squarely on point—dealt with a local law providing that:
“Whoever places on public or private property, a symbol, object, appellation, characterization or graffiti, including, but not limited to, a burning cross or Nazi swastika, which one knows or has reasonable grounds to know arouses anger, alarm or resentment in others on the basis of race, color, creed, religion or gender commits disorderly conduct and shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.”
Even though threatening speech and speaking on another’s property without permission are both otherwise unprotected forms of speech, the court held that because the law was content based (it singled out intimidation based on race, creed etc) it had to be subjected to strict scrutiny (a constitutional test unfavorable to the government).
This seems of apiece with desantis passing other bills—like the social media common carrier legislation and the ban on anti-white workplace DIE sessions—that are good policy but shoddily drafted and vulnerable to 1A challenges. Except in this case the law is not good policy
I agree, terrific summarization of HB 269 and its impact on free speech in America and why DeSantis ushered in a defining moment for his political prospects with many conservatives.
My guess is that meatball Ron realised how poorly he's doing with the base and donors and is trying to out-institution Trump and thinks that he can get the zionist neocon wing on side by catering to their hypersensitive obsession with anti-semitism laws. Same thing with the heartbeat bill, he's falling out with donors and congressional endorsements so he's going for institutions like the foreign policy blob and con inc media to try and get the 2024 nomination
Jewish legislator Randy Fine sponsored and helped author this speech killing bill. Jewish elites have been the tip of the spear when it comes to attacking the 1st amendment and arguing for so called hate speech laws, Big Tech censorship, digital book burnings at Amazon and so many other things. The ADL is no friend of a robust 1st amendment.
I haven't heard of any pending legal challenges from civil liberties groups if any still exist. This will be a real test for the SCOTUS if it ever gets to them.
Unless Trump speaks out against this bill I don't see how he's any better than DeSantis.
Please respond to my comment in your previous substack post.